All IRC Live! events are moderated. This means that audience members message their questions to the moderator and the moderator asks questions in the channel, so any question that comes from 'lcModerator' is a question from an audience member. Thanks and enjoy the log.
Brian Richardson, one of our Linux.com contributors, talked about some of the basics of setting up your own network in your home. Although gritty details weren't covered, he made sure to reference elsewhere for some of the more detailed information needed.
<brianr007> Ladies & Gentelmen
<brianr007> and Windows users
<will`> Wee! :)
<brianr007> Welcome to Linux.com Live!
--- starlady sets mode +m
<brianr007> Tonight is a basic introduction to Linux networking
<brianr007> But first, a few ground rules
<brianr007> (1) No talking out of turn. I (brianr007) am the host. Many others will be called upon as experts.
<brianr007> but, all questions should be messaged to lcmoderator
<starlady> brianr007 puts the smack down
<brianr007> he will pass them into the channel
<brianr007> "Can you smell what brianr007" is cooking?
* brianr007 digresses
<brianr007> (2) This broadcast cannot be retransmitted without the expressed & written permission of Major League Baseball
<brianr007> (3) Transcripts will be available at linux.com by the end of this week
<brianr007> (4) Offer void in Georgia. 6% sales tax applicable.
<brianr007> (5) Any questions not answered here may come up in another fourm, such as the upcoming Linux.com Live! event about firewalls
<brianr007> (check your local listings)
<starlady> brianr007: can you hang on a sec
<brianr007> (6) brianr007 is a bad typist, so go easy
* brianr007 waits
<starlady> brianr007: we're getting that announcement made so we may have more people
* brianr007 hums
* brianr007 idle for 18 seconds
<starlady> it's coming
<lcmoderator> <will`> Can we hear a bit about who Brian is? :)
<brianr007> so, two penguins waddle into a bar ...
<lcmoderator> <Saltbread> is it ok if we laugh because brianr007 is really funny ??
<starlady> Saltbread: go ahead, he's this funny in real life too :)
<starlady> brianr007: obviously, said announcement has gone out, so proceed at your leisure :) and thanks for holding
<brianr007> it's a bit crowded in here ...
<starlady> yeah, and someone's taking a shower, what's up with that
<starlady> this is a family channel ;P
<brianr007> anybody else ...
<brianr007> Bueller ...
<brianr007> Bueller ...
<brianr007> let's try this again ...
<brianr007> I (brianr007) will be the host for tonight's Linux.com Live! event
<brianr007> Tonight's topic is basic Linux networking
<brianr007> First, basic rules (again, for those joining late)
<brianr007> All questions should be messaged to lcmoderator
<brianr007> No talking out of turn
<brianr007> Several in the audience are plants, and will be called upon as "experts" during the show
<brianr007> (do not be alarmed, they know who they are)
<brianr007> A transcript/summary of this event will be posted on linux.com later in the week
<brianr007> Several networking topics will not be covered in this event ...
<brianr007> but will be in future Live events of Linux.com articles
<brianr007> For example ... an upcoming session on firewalls (very nice)
<brianr007> Plus ...
<brianr007> past articles on SAMBA & general networking can be found in the Linux.com archives
<brianr007> Now for introductions of the main players ...
<brianr007> I (brianr007), in real life, am Brian Richardson
<brianr007> Former Program Manager of Linux.com Hardware
<brianr007> Author of n+1 hardware articles, plus many Tux Noir articles
<brianr007> I am representing the nuts+bolts aspect of this session
<brianr007> Plus playing Dennis Miller to my Al Michaels ... xeno42 (linux.com web dude)
<brianr007> (he's British, don't be alarmed)
<brianr007> lcmoderator's identity was changed to protect the innocent ... just send him the questions
* brianr007 waits for it all to sink in
* lcmoderator curtseys
<brianr007> ok, are we ready to partyyyyyyyyyy ...
<brianr007> oops, wrong show
<brianr007> Ready kids?
* brianr007 takes silence as acknowledgement
<brianr007> First, let's talk about basic configuration ... hardware
<brianr007> Many users will have a network device in the system when installing Linux for the first time
<brianr007> This makes things a lot easier in the long run ...
<brianr007> since many distributions will not install ANY network support if no network device is present at install
--- #live :The hand of the deity is upon you, thy nick may not change
* starlady is away: dinner
<brianr007> So before installing a distribution, check their hardware compatability database (or support page) to make sure you're card is covered
<brianr007> Many problems are solved by this simple task
<brianr007> If you don't have a card already picked out for the system, I have a few preferences ...
<brianr007> Intel PRO/100 (aka EtherExpress, ee100)
<brianr007> Linksys 100TX
<brianr007> Both available most anywhere parts are sold
<brianr007> There are dozens of cards supported by Linux, but make sure it's on the list
<lcmoderator> <will`> How well are wireless lan cards supported?
<lcmoderator> <will`> And WLAN in general
<brianr007> One point of confusion ... the card's brand name isn't always listed as supported,
<brianr007> but the chip on the card will be
<brianr007> will`: that's a great question ... xeno42 has more experience with that than I
<xeno42> wlan is supported pretty well
<xeno42> most cards are supported afaik
<xeno42> there are whole websites devoted to the topic
<xeno42> we did a live event about it from Linuxworld last month in fact
<brianr007> one thing to note ... many current distributions won't detect these cards at install time
<brianr007> but they're added to the configuration pretty easily
<lcmoderator> <Kingsqueak> little information on performance specs of ethernet chipsets specific to linux is available, can you ask brian to justify a bit as to why those chipsets are his preference?
<brianr007> Kingsqueak: sure
<brianr007> the performance is part of the issue, but it really comesdown to stability and ease of support
<brianr007> Many "generic" cards won't run as fast because the chips don't support full-duplex
<brianr007> (send & transmit at the same time)
<lcmoderator> <Saltbread> hmm...when Xeno is finished, could you tell Brian that I think that the module name for the Intel card he spoke of might not be ee100...not 100% sure though....could be wrong...
<brianr007> or use really bad components
<brianr007> but with Linux ... especially before the 2.4 kernel ...
<brianr007> drivers were the real problem
<brianr007> The Intel card is pretty universal now, so the support is there in the kernel & driver set
<xeno42> Intel driver is eepro100 typically; very common
<brianr007> The Linksys card is based on the DEC Tulip chipset ...
<brianr007> and that's one of the best drivers (IMHO) in the Linux world
<brianr007> it's fairly old (aka proven)
<brianr007> right ... eepro100 is the Intel module name (thanks)
<brianr007> With a lot of new distros (Mandrake 8.0, RedHat 7.x, SuSe 7.x, ...), the installer is very intelligent
<brianr007> and will detect network cards easily
<brianr007> especially if they're PCI-based cards
<brianr007> sidenote ... stick with PCI on newer systems (fewer headaches)
<brianr007> anyway ... assuming the card is detected, and your network cable is hooked up to something useful
<brianr007> the hardware is done
<brianr007> (unless you want to change hardware later ... we'll keep that topic for later)
<brianr007> now linux has to be configured to find the rest of the network ... the internet & all that
<brianr007> xeno ... you want to take this topic for a minute?
<xeno42> i think you're doing fine ;-)
<brianr007> well, up till this point ... you might be better at all the settings & such
<brianr007> (I cheat & use linuxconf a lot :) )
<lcmoderator> <will`> Cross platform networking: what problems could occur networking a Linux box to a Windows one?
<brianr007> will`: that's kinda a SAMBA question ... we'll touch on that later
<xeno42> well, with your network card detected, your distribution install program is likely to ask you a few questions to configure your new network card
<xeno42> those will include: IP address, DNS addresses and gateway address.
<xeno42> If you're on a larger network, you may be able to make use of DHCP, if such a server is available
<xeno42> if you can use that then getting yourself online suddenly becomes very easy as your Linux machine can just ask the DHCP server for the right settings automatically. However, if you're setting this up at home, chances are that isn't an option
<brianr007> DHCP == Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol (hands your PC an IP address)
<xeno42> The IP address you use will depend on what sort of network you're joining. If you're on a 'real' network, the network administrator will give you an IP address.. If you're connecting to the Internet via a cable modem connected to your network card then you will want to use an IP address specified by your isp
<xeno42> and that's part of a larger issue, which we've covered on linux.com
<xeno42> but for now, we'll assume you're setting up a little network, isolated from the rest of the world
<xeno42> so you'll need to pick an address to use.. - You shouldn't pick just any address though
--- Notify: shaleh is offline (sagan.openprojects.net).
<xeno42> there are ranges of IP addresses reserved for 'private' (non Internet) use.
<xeno42> For our example here we can choose 192.168.1.1 as our machine's address, with a netmask of 255.255.255.0
<xeno42> if we added another machine to the network, it could have 192.168.1.2
<xeno42> as we're isolated from the world, we can leave the gateway blank - but if you have a router on the network, you'd specify it's IP address here
<brianr007> to add some definitions ...
<brianr007> "gateway" defines the IP of the machine that allows you to get to the Internet
<brianr007> if you're using a router to get onto the Internet (like one of those Linksys boxes),
<brianr007> then it would be that device/machine
<lcmoderator> <will`> Protocols?
<brianr007> Those are the basic bits of information you'll have to provide during installation
<brianr007> Procotol ... Linux, by default, does everything using TCP/IP (basic Internet protocol)
<brianr007> There are kernel options to support other more obscure protocols, but those are mostly for older systems (like AppleTalk)
<brianr007> In general, TCP/IP for everything
<brianr007> Which makes it easier to talk to other PCs
<brianr007> With Windows, you'll need extra software to have see the "Windows Network Neighborhood" (sp?)
<lcmoderator> <will`> How would internet connection sharing work?
<brianr007> That's called SAMBA ... it implements the SMB protocol on top of TCP/IP
<brianr007> will`: sit down, young man ... I'm getting to it
* brianr007 can;t type that fast
<brianr007> anyway ... SAMBA is another session, because it's not really "basic" networking
<brianr007> with Windows, it's the built-in way that computers share information
<brianr007> with Linux, since it's designed to be more flexible, there's no real "assumed" default
<brianr007> many other standards, like NFS, can be used (depending on what you're trying to share data with)
<brianr007> Anyway ... connection sharing ...
<brianr007> There's two setups here ...
<brianr007> (1) The Linux machine is going to use a shared connection (like a Linksys router)
<brianr007> (2) The Linux machine will provide the shared connection to other PCs on the network
<brianr007> The second setup will be covered some in the Linux.com Live! event on firewalls (tomorrow at 8PM EDT, I think)
<brianr007> A lot of Linux-based "firewalls" are really acting as both firewall and router
<brianr007> firewall == a network packet filter, designed to keep undesired traffic off your network
<brianr007> (these keep nasty script kiddies with too much time on their hands out of your precious MP3 collection)
<brianr007> router == used to define a network device that moves packets from one network segment to another ...
<brianr007> in this case from your "private" network to the public Internet
<brianr007> the router does the real "sharing" work
--- starlady gives voice to ElectricElf
<ElectricElf> Oh, thank you starlady :)
<brianr007> Linux handles through "IP masquerading" ... making one IP from an Internet provider provide a connection to many PCs
<brianr007> I yield to ElectricElf at the request of the lady ...
<ElectricElf> Hehehe :) What was the question?
<starlady> nah, he's just here to hang out
<brianr007> nutz ... don;t do that
<ElectricElf> starlady: Yeah :)
<starlady> if I interrupt you'll know it
<starlady> something like: shut up and let the man speak
* starlady runs like heck
* brianr007 throws cat out of his fish dinner and goes on
<brianr007> anyway ...
<brianr007> In setup 1 (Linux using a shared connection) ...
<brianr007> Linux doesn;t care from where the packets come
<brianr007> Just make sure the Linux machine is configured to use an IP address that matches the scheme of the sharing system (tends to be 192.168.xxx.xxx)
<brianr007> and lists the proper gateway address (in many cases, 192.168.0.1 or 192.168.1.1)
<brianr007> oh ... almost forgot ...
* starlady is back (gone 00:37:55)
<brianr007> you need to also specify the Domain Name Server (DNS) the network uses
<brianr007> DNS == turns sitenames into IP addresses (it's a HUGE looktable)
<brianr007> er, lookup table
<lcmoderator> <m0rt> But how would you set it up if your DSL provider gave you a unique IP address for every machine on your network?
<brianr007> m0rt: that's a different setup than connection sharing ...
<brianr007> because you're not really sharing the connection
<brianr007> in that case, the DSL provider will hand you some static IP addresses
<brianr007> and you set each PC up with its own address
<brianr007> (some may also provide a nice router at your site, but that's only in expensive business configurations)
<lcmoderator> <drnoah> it's worth pointing out, you can have a mix of several public IPs, and several internal ones (as I do)
<lcmoderator> <Kingsqueak> in the case of several live ip's you would be best served to configure a bridge device firewall with no ip addresses on its interfaces, this would be placed 'in-front' of the switch where all the clients are connected
<brianr007> "connection sharing" really means "how can I get everybody on-line without paying the phone company too much money" :)
<brianr007> drnoah: right. I've done that before as well ...
<brianr007> anyway ... this is supposed to be basic networking ...
<brianr007> so now I summon the mighty xeno42 to help users find out how to change these parameters when Linux is up and running
<brianr007> xeno42: can you give a quick rundown of changing parameters?
<xeno42> well now, that's very much going to depend on which distribution you're using
<brianr007> well, that's true
<xeno42> If you're running RedHat then you'll probably want to use linuxconf
<brianr007> same goes for Mandrake
<xeno42> I'm not familiar with Mandrake, but it's probably the same
<xeno42> SuSE has Yast
<xeno42> ie. most of the beginner-oriented distributions have one main tool used to configure all the main settings
<xeno42> Distributions like Debian and Slackware, on the other hand, are another matter
<ElectricElf> Debian: A configuration file(usually edited by hand), /etc/network/interfaces, and a command('/etc/init.d/networking restart').
<xeno42> you'll probably be editing files by hand in those instances
<lcmoderator> <Saltbread> could you tell Xeno that under Red Hat that linuxconf is being depreciated...i.e there are no longer gonna be putting it into their distribution...
* xeno42 runs Debian personally
<xeno42> no doubt the configuration tools for Redhat et al are available from a menu on the desktop
<brianr007> but it's nice to know the files, just in case the nifty tool is unavailable
<lcmoderator> Saltbread> tell him he can use "setup" from the console prompt under Red Hat...that has a built in menu program the covers that sort of thing...
<brianr007> for the average user, hand-editing files isn't the right way to go ...
<brianr007> the networking HOW-TOs (available at linux.com) cover this in good detail
<brianr007> but, most folks can rely on their distribution-provided tools
<brianr007> most of which run in the fun colors of X
<brianr007> We're at a good point for questions from the audience ...
<brianr007> I know we've probably missed what a lot of people wanted to talk about ...
<lcmoderator> <OpSo-user> what are the tools to use, to get a proxy with GNU/Linux as server and Win32 as clients?
<brianr007> Proxy? Does it have to be proxy, or just connection sharing in general?
<brianr007> The two are very different ...
<xeno42> OpSo-user: If you want a real web proxy, the application you're looking for is called Squid. If you just want to share a connection then that's another matter
>brianr007< let me know when you want me to unmoderate it and we'll open it up for general q&a/discussion
<brianr007> Proxy is like what AOL does ... no, not sending 10,000,000 free CDs in the mail ...
<brianr007> Proxy basically caches internet content (websites) on a computer ...
<brianr007> then everybody else on the network uses that cache as their web content
<brianr007> proxy has serious problems with any site that updates content on a regular basis
<brianr007> (like cnn.com, message boards or any cartoon site)
<brianr007> that's why so many sites have disclaimers about access via AOL
<brianr007> If you ABSOLUTELY have to have it ... ther's a HOW-TO (yippie)
<xeno42> i don't think that's the one you mean
<brianr007> well, perhaps I grabbed the wrong HOW-TO
<brianr007> ARP ... geez, I hit the Smithsonian section of linux.com for that ...
<brianr007> damn you right-click ... damn you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
<brianr007> anyway, I'm sure somebody will find the right one on Linux.com ... it does exist
<brianr007> but (IMHO) Proxy may not be the way to go ona new setup
<lcmoderator> <Kingsqueak> caching proxies have very serious utility when doing content filtering as they avoid the burden of refiltering commonly fetched pages in those situations. This is quite common in corporate networking configurations. Additionally most proxies have the ability to setup cache expirations by domains, so commonly accessed domains such as cnn.com can have a 30min expiration for refresh or less.
<brianr007> Kingsqueak: yes, they do have their place ...
<brianr007> anyway ... any other questions?
<lcmoderator> no questions here
<brianr007> ok, then we can open the room to a free-for-all-Texas-information-battle-royal ...
--- starlady sets mode -m
<brianr007> or take this party down the street
<starlady> thanks very much brianr007, xeno42, and everyone else who participated
* brianr007 bows
--- ElectricElf removes voice from ElectricElf
--- lcmoderator is now known as influx
* brianr007 hopes this helps somebody
<starlady> logs will be posted on linux.com by week's end
<brianr007> don't forget to check linux.com for upcoming Live! events
<sparky> can you answer just one more question?
<ElectricElf> Proxies are a (more primitive, in my opinion) form of connection-sharing. Instead of just attempting to make connections, the client application *asks* the proxy to make the connection, explicitly. While that sort of setup has advantages, it is not as flexible as Network Address Translation and Masquerading. As such, there are many different types of proxies, like Squid the http/ftp proxy. So to be able to answer that question, more inf
<starlady> right, tomorrow we're setting up a firewall
<ElectricElf> OpSo-user: So would you like to refine your question further?
<brianr007> sparky: fire!
<OpSo-user> OpSo-user: nope, thanks anyway :)
<ElectricElf> OpSo-user: Heh :) Gotcha ;)
<sparky> I've got two NICs, I understand that there's a way to have only one IP for both, is this correct?
<sparky> Both NICs are in one box (running RH 7.1)
<brianr007> well, sort of ... that's not a typical configuration (or necessarily recommended)
--- starlady has changed the topic to: #live Welcome to Linux.com Live! Our next event is "Configuring A Firewall With Linux", Wednesday at 6PM PDT.
<brianr007> xeno42: help me with sparky here ...
<xeno42> sparky: what are you trying to achieve exactly?
<m0rt> two nics are usually used for a linux router bridging two networks
<sparky> The two NICs I have, one USB and one PCMCIA. I have to deactivate one or the other to comm with the NT 4.0 box, I was hoping there was some way
<sparky> to have both operating so that when I change from the slower USB to the faster PCMCIA (for file xfer) I wouldn't have to deactivate/activate one over the other.
<brianr007> sparky: so both NICs are on the same network with the NT box?
<brianr007> sparky: that's not a a typical configuration
<sparky> yep. but the PCMCIA runs hot, so I like to use USB unless a large file xfer is needed.
<brianr007> well ...
<brianr007> you can give each NIC a different IP address, and pick the IP based on the transfer type
<m0rt> i don't think it would damage it even if you put a high load on it
<brianr007> everything PCMCIA runs hot
<brianr007> it's designed to
<brianr007> just take the laptop off of your lap when sending over 100 MB ;)
<m0rt> i wouldn't worry about it
<m0rt> it's sort of awkward to do what you are attempting to do
<Kingsqueak> a hint, make sure the USB interface is forced to the proper transfer mode, some interfaces take a 15% performance hit when left in 'auto' mode
<Kingsqueak> that is if the driver supports forcing full-duplex or half-duplex
<brianr007> well, USB does suck as a network interface ...
<brianr007> a 10baseT connection eats all of your USB bandwidth ...
<brianr007> so I'd use the PCMCIA whenever available
--- ChanServ gives channel operator status to Beret
<sparky> they both run full-duplex @ 100 Mbps, but as you know, USB is only about half the speed due to its limitations (at least until 2.0 is out), but I try to keep this Dell Inspiron 7000 running as cool as possible. At least now I can use the USB adapter (couldn't when running RH 5.2). I just thought I had read somewhere that you could "ghost" one adapter to use the same IP as another installed in the same system.
<brianr007> er, no sparky
<brianr007> USB runs (at best) 12 Mbps
<brianr007> add about 10% for transaction overhead ... and that's a full-duplex 10BaseT connection
<m0rt> does anyone here know if the Intel Inbusiness 10/100 8 port switch is good, or should i spend the extra on a similar 3com?
<Saltbread> brianr007: or anyone else, which is faster usb, printer or serial ports?
<ElectricElf> m0rt: I've had good luck with Intel networking hardware. Never specifically switches, though.
<brianr007> sparky: you can make one ethernet adapter run multiple addresses, but the other way around is kinda weird
<influx> i'm happy with my dlink 8 port switch
<m0rt> influx: how much did you pay for it?
<brianr007> Saltbread: USB, printer, then serial (in descending order)
<influx> about $60 if i remember
<lazarus> how plausible is it to have two separate cables between the two machines?
<brianr007> sparky: the problem with making two cards handle one IP address ...
<Saltbread> alright I got a weird question: how plausible is it to have bought an external USR modem and a cable to connect to your computer and the cable not be a RS232 cable but the modem still work
<brianr007> sparky: is that TCP/IP packets have this annoying habit of arriving out of order
<brianr007> sparky: so it's hard to sort packets from two interfaces that are trying to look like one IP
<m0rt> Saltbread: the 5686D?
<Saltbread> nah....that one is the new Performance modem...I'm talking about the older V90 based USR modems...
<Saltbread> I doubt they make them anymore...
<brianr007> Saltbread: what is is hooked up to?
<sparky> I don't have two cables, just one. I unplug the USB when switching over to the PCMCIA, but then I have to deactivate one and activate the other. This seems to throw the NT box into the ozone for a bit before things get squared. Thanks for the feedback, tho!
<brianr007> sparky: it's not confusing the NT box, it's confusing your hub
<Saltbread> you see my problem is that I have one and it doesn't do 56k connections very well...it may connect anywhere between 44000 and 45333 but the connection rates are always up and down....when I force the modem (using init settings) to 33.6 connections, no matter what I download I get constant 3.6-3.8 downloads as you might expect...but when I let the modem connect at whatever it wants to connect at, inconsistency
<brianr007> sparky: see, every network card has something called a MAC address
<brianr007> sparky: that's what your hub uses to move stuff from one port to the next (it's somewhat intelligent)
<sparky> Ah, bet you're right. It's actually the switch, tho an active hub would store the MACs, too.
<brianr007> sparky: so your hub has this internal link between your PC's IP, MAC & port number
--- Beret is now known as Beret_afk
<brianr007> sparky: change one, and the hub has to re-do it's route scheme
<brianr007> sparky: the hubs we used to have at work did this all the time ... get a new IP, wait forever to pass traffic again
<brianr007> (we threw them away)
<Saltbread> I borrowed a friend's modem....the USR 2677 I believe...it is the one featured every month in PCGamer in the back when they are talking about the best equipment for your system...anyway, his modem connects around 45333 and downloads like a dream...very consistent...that's why I wondered if an external modem with a non RS232 cable could explain my problems
<brianr007> Saltbread: internal or external? software or hardware data-pump?
<brianr007> Saltbread: that makes a big difference
<Saltbread> even more interesting is the fact that I bought a Dlink USB DU-560M (it's the Latin American version of the DSB560 usb modem) recently and I got the same shitty results when letting the modem connect at whatever it wanted to... do I assume it is an external modem problem?
<Saltbread> it's a hardware modem...at least I assume so since it is external....
<brianr007> Saltbread: most USB modems won't be hardware-based (and most Dlink modems are scary)
<brianr007> Saltbread: external serial-port modems are still the best (they're just expensive and hard to find)
<Saltbread> brianr007: well I found out that the North American version is hardware-based or at least complies with ACM...the South American version doesn't...
<m0rt> the 3com USR 5685D is nice
<m0rt> and i think you can get it for under $80
<m0rt> it's the newest USR external serial 56k
<Saltbread> brianr007: well...recently (as in yesterday) I discovered that my modem could be flash updated to V92 based code...
<Saltbread> so I did just that and upgraded it....
<Saltbread> unfortunately, my ISP doesn't support V92....
<brianr007> Saltbread: very few support V92
<Saltbread> since the update, the modem has been connecting at paltry connection rates....REALLY REALLY paltry....
<brianr007> Saltbread: V92 is a last chance for modems to do anything new (and many phone lines won't support it)
<Saltbread> e.g first time out it was 32.2, then 29.2 then 38.something etc...I just don't know what to do...I have been looking into getting one like my friend but money is a major consideration...
<lazarus> how does V92 differ from V90? (in a nutshell)
<brianr007> like V90, but supposed to give high-speed both ways
<brianr007> instead of just downstream
<brianr007> it suffers from the same problems that V90 did when it first came out ... phone line wiring problems, lack of ISP support, bad 1st generation firmware upgrades
<Saltbread> There are selling a V92 external USR in a store here...and a ISA based USR as well...short of buying one like my friend's off the net, I am stumped as to what to do...
<m0rt> people don't really care now since cable and dsl are becoming more common
<m0rt> so i guess the ISPs aren't rushing to implement it
<lazarus> and isps are probably less willing now to upgrade hardware, with less new customers likely
<brianr007> m0rt: exactly ... modem vendors needed something new as excuse to charge more for a dying product line
<brianr007> modems are becomming a commodity item
<brianr007> they're easily emulated with little software, and can be bought for under $20 in a PC shop
<m0rt> i just wish DSL/cable were available where i live :(
<Saltbread> I wish I could convince little old Barbados ISPs of that...there is DSL here now but it is unaffordable...whats more....not all of the telephone lines are DSL technology....
<Saltbread> the whole thing is just annoying me....
<brianr007> hey, It's still a problem in the US
<brianr007> I had to beat on my telco for 9 months to get DSL ... and I'm 25 miles from Atlanta
<m0rt> they have DSL 3 blocks down from me but not where i live :(
<Saltbread> oh btw guys, will` said to tell you guys thanks for the info....he plans to make the jump to Linux soon hopefully....
<brianr007> the home of the telco I was beating on
<Saltbread> the only solution I see working for me for sure is a new modem like my friends or the one that I think m0rt mentioned...
--- You are now known as star_sleep
<Saltbread> the new Performance Pro or something like that it is called...
<brianr007> anyway, I'm going to smack X4 into submission (try to play nice with my notebook's Nvidia GeForce2)
<m0rt> or you could just get some cheap internal PCI job =)